fmic now in

[RanGer498]

well just finished installing my front mount intercooler (fmic)

[RanGer498]

;)

[RanGer498]

:D

[tripodal]

Mighty mighty sharp... now all you need is some NOS to make it icy cold before a run!!! :)

or will the nos be going directly into the chambers?

[RanGer498]

no nos needed she should have 600rwhp w/the spturbo when the motor comes back :D(i hope)

[tripodal]

fantastic.... viper stomper huh? thats assuming you can keep the rear end down... how do you plan on managing that?

i remember an article ... someone controled the boost with thier traction control system... decreasing boost when wheel spin occured.
wasnt a supra tho.

and origonally meant nos for the intercooler... cause i know that intercooler may not be eneough... not for that much air.

[Farabomb]

That's beautiful. Hope to see it around... Well at least a blurred black streak.:xthumb:

[4.6POWER]

ranger could you have gone wider? I mean just so the end tanks don't show? Looks like a pretty clean kit.. spearco core I assume?

[RanGer498]

wider yes but not by much and i wont gain much ! I did my homewok on this for 4 months and bigger is not always better i have found out ! this unit(greddy 3row) is made to run with my stock twins perfectly till my motor is broken and then when my single goes in it can then support over 700rwhp motor This kit is designed to give a maximum cooling capacity while allowing for a minimal pressure drop.

this unit retails for $2,150.00

then next unit up is the 4row !

so you can see how big this unit is check this out(this is the same 3row but still taped up )!


greddy (http://www.greddy.com/products/Intercoolers_frame.htm)

Originally posted by 4.6POWER
ranger could you have gone wider? I mean just so the end tanks don't show? Looks like a pretty clean kit.. spearco core I assume?

[4.6POWER]

you own a supra and you saying bigger isn't better, shame on you! ;) j/k

I take it that is a greddy kit of some type... yeah dude it looks bad azz especially with the guy holding it. 4 months eh?? wanna find one for me too? ;) Already talking about blowing up the motor... now your talkin like a supra owner. :D See you at etown sometime, shoot me a pm when your ready for a test 'n tune night with your new toys... I'll christen the talon too.

[RanGer498]

yup greddy 3row kit ..honestly i dont know why but a lot of talon and gsx owners are emailing me for my stock side mount intercooler there good for a little over 500 hp it has been reported!

ill be dyno testing soon if you want i can pick you up and we can test her out together!



Originally posted by 4.6POWER
you own a supra and you saying bigger isn't better, shame on you! ;) j/k

I take it that is a greddy kit of some type... yeah dude it looks bad azz especially with the guy holding it. 4 months eh?? wanna find one for me too? ;) Already talking about blowing up the motor... now your talkin like a supra owner. :D See you at etown sometime, shoot me a pm when your ready for a test 'n tune night with your new toys... I'll christen the talon too.

[tripodal]

Originally posted by RanGer498
This kit is designed to give a maximum cooling capacity while allowing for a minimal pressure drop.


dont you want the intercooler to create as much pressure drop as possible from cooling the air?
i understood that when creating boost the air would increase in temperature 100C or someting around there, the point then i thought was to decrease the temperature A.) to prevent detonation B.) to flow the same amount of air w/ running less psi boost C.) so you would also be able to increase boost further to make up the temp/pressure drop.

is that all totally wrong ?

[dicki]

woah, i should have popped my head in here before, that is a sweet looking mod, supras are fantastic cars.

speaking of sticking the car to the ground i think jet engines are the way forward :D i saw some south african dirttrack racing a little while ago where they have really light hayabusa powered cars with 2 little jet engines strapped to them, all the jet engines are there for is to push the back wheels of the car into the ground to increase traction, the hayabusa engine provides the forward shove :D

[gypseyman]

Ranger...

:xjawdrop: :xjawdrop: :xjawdrop: :xjawdrop: :xjawdrop:

:D

[4.6POWER]

ranger- definitely!

tripodal- you are right to a certain extent... you want to cool the air down and drop the pressure resulted from expanded hot air... but you also don't want to slow the velocity of the air. If that should happen, then you are "loosing boost" and actually getting less molecules of air into the engine, creating less power. Say he tripled the size of his intercooler... his turbo(s) would run out of breath in an instant trying to fill all that volume... that the velocity of air at the throttle body would be so slow it would not even pay to have the turbo to begin with. Your really just striving for a happy medium here. Hot air = less molecules of air per volume of space & increased chance of detonation... all you want an intercooler to do is undo exactly that. You want fast moving cold air.

PSI is actually just a measure of back pressure... 10psi on a big turbo is giving you more are than say 12psi on a smaller turbo... because the bigger turbo is flowing more air into the engine and less back pressure can be created.

sorry.. got a little carried away here! ;)

[dicki]

don't big turbo's take a long time to spin up though? resulting in huge lag between stomping on the gas and actually going anywhere... i keep thinking it would be much better to have multiple smaller turbos closer to the exhaust manifold (hotter air i know but...) to get a really rapid spin up and let the power increase happen a lot earlier... i'm assuming there must be a good reason why people arn't doing this allready

also does anyone use the old lancia delta integrale method of keeping the turbine speed up by recycling the gasses again instead of venting them through a dump valve?

dicki

[RanGer498]

really big turbos do! but they need to have a really big A/R but its all a misunderstanding how the power comes on!

the 1st pic is of stock supra twins bpu vs a single turbo kit thats close to mine

the second pic is of a big single turbo with a larger A/r also

the 3rd pic is of a greddy single kit vs a ph single stage 2 kit

all these are on supras


pic 1http://www.powerhouseracing.com/Photo_Album/Dyno_Sheets/PHR%20Stage%202%20versus%20BPU.jpg[i]Originally posted by dicki [/img]

pic 2http://www.powerhouseracing.com/Photo_Album/Dyno_Sheets/PHR%20Stage%203%20versus%20Stage%202.jpg

pic3http://www.powerhouseracing.com/Photo_Album/Dyno_Sheets/stage2vsGreddyT78.jpg



don't big turbo's take a long time to spin up though? resulting in huge lag between stomping on the gas and actually going anywhere... i keep thinking it would be much better to have multiple smaller turbos closer to the exhaust manifold (hotter air i know but...) to get a really rapid spin up and let the power increase happen a lot earlier... i'm assuming there must be a good reason why people arn't doing this allready

also does anyone use the old lancia delta integrale method of keeping the turbine speed up by recycling the gasses again instead of venting them through a dump valve?

dicki

[RanGer498]

lol could nothave said it any better!;)Originally posted by 4.6POWER
ranger- definitely!

tripodal- you are right to a certain extent... you want to cool the air down and drop the pressure resulted from expanded hot air... but you also don't want to slow the velocity of the air. If that should happen, then you are "loosing boost" and actually getting less molecules of air into the engine, creating less power. Say he tripled the size of his intercooler... his turbo(s) would run out of breath in an instant trying to fill all that volume... that the velocity of air at the throttle body would be so slow it would not even pay to have the turbo to begin with. Your really just striving for a happy medium here. Hot air = less molecules of air per volume of space & increased chance of detonation... all you want an intercooler to do is undo exactly that. You want fast moving cold air.

PSI is actually just a measure of back pressure... 10psi on a big turbo is giving you more are than say 12psi on a smaller turbo... because the bigger turbo is flowing more air into the engine and less back pressure can be created.

sorry.. got a little carried away here! ;)

[tripodal]

thank you for explaining that... the velocity of the air wasnt soemthing that i had considered.

[Mad Bad John]

Big laggy turbos are much more fun - when you get that kick in your tail - its something else!!

My Esprit S2 Turbo had a little extra - a waste gate in your right ear - loads of fun :xthrowa:

[4.6POWER]

:D :D Glad you like my explanation ninja's ;)

Dicki- Some people do the two small turbo route instead of one... but you have to realize you are doubling the backpressure that a single turbo would create by using two. With this effect... you are sort of undoing the fast spool up effect you just tried to create. You are also flowing half as much air through each turbo... which makes them harder to really get going and keep going. Bottom line, smaller turbos just can't cram as much air in the motor as bigger ones can.. especially at higher RPM where they start to really lose efficiency and begin heating the air. Most cars with twin setups only have it to make the car feel like a larger naturally aspirated engine... others use them sequentially like the supra, but ultimately... you need a big turbo to put out big horsepower.

Some cars recirculate the blow off valve air back into the turbo inlet to keep it spooled... just like my mitsubishi does. I don't know if rangers supra does or not. I'll have to take some pics sometime to show ya's :) later,

Joe

[dicki]

heh heh i love fast cars :) thanks for explaining that turbo thing to me i knew there must be a good reason for it...

how about using 2 different size turbo's? one little one to pick up fast and a big un that kicks in later and gives the horsepower? you can tell i know nothing about cars but it's allways good to learn.

so how much do you reackon that supra's going to cost in the end ranger?

dicki

[RanGer498]

4.6
the stock set up is with a recirculate the blow off valve some peoplelike me put a BOV that releases to the air some are good some are not ..i had the hks unit SSbov and it worked great but some units like the apexi BOV dont work too well in stock form supras

diki it might work but to fabricate that would cost to much and the gain would be too small !

this is a vid of my friends supra with a single turbo (its a power house stage 2 only at 23 psi )mine will spool faster but will have less top end..like i will need more top end :D

vid one (http://www.tbe.net/~supra/video/993kill.wmv)
vid two (65.108.8.47/nemkiv/videos/priceless.wmv)

my whole set up will cost me with fuel and all the computers needed around $11,000 and im doing 95% of the labor ..again i can go with a bigger turbo for more ttop end but my car will be a daily driver so i rather get more low end punch!

Originally posted by dicki

how about using 2 different size turbo's? one little one to pick up fast and a big un that kicks in later and gives the horsepower? you can tell i know nothing about cars but it's allways good to learn.

so how much do you reackon that supra's going to cost in the end ranger?

dicki

[4.6POWER]

dicki-it's funny you should say that you don't know so much about cars... because everything your suggesting is exactly the way most stock turbo cars come. Rangers supra comes twin turbo and is setup just like you said... one small turbo to get the party started real quick... then a bigger turbo takes over and keeps things goin! The mazda RX-7 comes this way also.

Most smaller cars like my 4-cyl just don't have the room for all this plumbing work... plus it adds greatly to the cost. Both of those cars above are more than twice the price of mine. Cars are cool!

[RanGer498]

actually the turbos on the supra are the same size .... i belive on my stealth r/t turbo the front one is smaller and the rear bigger!thow....to ad the talon when worked on can walk over supras with less hp have to love them talons! Originally posted by 4.6POWER
dicki-it's funny you should say that you don't know so much about cars... because everything your suggesting is exactly the way most stock turbo cars come. Rangers supra comes twin turbo and is setup just like you said... one small turbo to get the party started real quick... then a bigger turbo takes over and keeps things goin! The mazda RX-7 comes this way also.

Most smaller cars like my 4-cyl just don't have the room for all this plumbing work... plus it adds greatly to the cost. Both of those cars above are more than twice the price of mine. Cars are cool!

[dicki]

ahhh i see....

i do enjoy the rx7... i allways thought rotary engines would be a good idea... it seems weird they never took off (i understand there are reliability problems or something)

i know a little about cars (as in what ones i like) but nothing techincal (my mechanic friends can vouch for that) i just try to say what seems sensible

so ranger is $11000 including the cost of the car or just the modding? jeez... you couldn't even get a really old second hand supra over here for that :(

dicki

[RanGer498]

yup there great cars but have heat issues when moded and stock motors only last for around 86,000-90,000 miles on the average

$11,000-just for the items the car ran me $23,000.00 usedOriginally posted by dicki
ahhh i see....

i allways thought rotary engines would be a good idea... it seems weird they never took off (i understand there are reliability problems or something)


so ranger is $11000 including the cost of the car or just the modding? jeez... you couldn't even get a really old second hand supra over here for that :(

dicki

[4.6POWER]

yeah.. rotaries are a great idea, but mazda has just had no success with them. They wear out quickly, are extremely delicate, don't even get better gas mileage or horsepower.

ranger I think the internals on your stock turbos are different? not sure... educate us mortals! hehe... I don't think my talon will ever be able to hang with the big dogg soups :( but I will mod it up soon.. I'm aiming for low 12's in street trim. :D

[RanGer498]

lol trust me see some sweet talons rip some supra a new azzOriginally posted by 4.6POWER
yeah.. rotaries are a great idea, but mazda has just had no success with them. They wear out quickly, are extremely delicate, don't even get better gas mileage or horsepower.

ranger I think the internals on your stock turbos are different? not sure... educate us mortals! hehe... I don't think my talon will ever be able to hang with the big dogg soups :( but I will mod it up soon.. I'm aiming for low 12's in street trim. :D

[Ottoman]

Originally posted by 4.6POWER
yeah.. rotaries are a great idea, but mazda has just had no success with them. They wear out quickly, are extremely delicate, don't even get better gas mileage or horsepower.




actually I have to disagree.... 1.3ltr 260 hp.... can't think of any normal engines that can do that...

volume/power ratio is much higher of the engine.

and the weight ratio is amazing 50/50 almost

ppl have tried putting V8's into RX7's and they have failed miserably

and if you're worried about turbo lag, get yourself a amazing exhaust.. and an ALS AKA Bang Bang...
problem solved :D

[RanGer498]

lag has nothing to do with an exaust but more with the a/r housing's Originally posted by Ottoman



and if you're worried about turbo lag, get yourself a amazing exhaust.. and an ALS AKA Bang Bang...
problem solved :D

[tripodal]

i believe a few RX-7 owners did away with some turbo lag... by installing the turbo directly onto the exaust ports... apparantly this is possibel with a special exaust manifolt... 1" long
the results were about 14psi at 2000rpm 21psi a 2600rpm and 33psi above 3000.... thats pretty fast spooling if i dont say so. tho i never saw the car.. it seems quite possible


or what about 6 small turbos... one on each exaust port, with an intercooler ducted into a big ol hood scoop, or did i smoke too much crack?

wher is my medecine

[4.6POWER]

waaaay too much crack! ;)

[Ottoman]

I thought lag was caused by the inertia of the blades on the fan...
and that's why turbo has to spool up...

with an ALS the turbo fans never slow down

[dicki]

low 12's? do you mean times for the standing 1/4 mile? how do you time that?

my cousin tuned up a mini cooper (i say tuned up i actually mean took apart and rebuilt from scratch using some really serious parts) and got it doing the standing quater in about 11.5seconds, it was the fastest mini in britain until the sequential gearbox broke and got stuck in second... he still beat the car he was racing though :D

dicki

oh FYI the car was called swifty, there might be some info about if you want me to look for it

[RanGer498]

at the race track Originally posted by dicki
low 12's? do you mean times for the standing 1/4 mile? how do you time that?