So what's going on in Ireland?

[JohnyX]

This sounds bad but I guess the press doesn't give a rip cause the majority of the U.S. population doesn't care unless we are dropping bombs. Are things calming down and are the fringe Protestants and Catholics getting along or are they just laying low until fighting terrorism is no longer the latest fad.

[Baptizer]

Ever been to the 'Shaggy Dog'?

[Mad Bad John]

Well........... you know how well the Israelies and Palestinians get on ? its a bit like that except they`ve had a bit more practice!

[dicki]

hummmm minor terrorism... nothing major just the same sort of thing thats been going on for years now

[lorddrakul]

Yeah X,
sorry to burst your bubble, but even when the US is having a bout of history the world carries blithely on having its own. Disrespectful I know, but there you go. No regard for decorum. Or CNN.

Yes the Catholics are still fighting, the Protestants are still fighting as are the Unionists, the Nationalists, the Republicans, the Loyalists and they are just the better know groups. There are still punishment beatings, arms finds, riots, sectarian murder and more drugs, prostitution and money laundering than you can shake a surgical 2x4 at.

You will forgive my cavalier attitude its just I'm stept in it. My mother was a Northern Catholic whose family were run out of town because her parents had the audacity to marry across the divide, she a Proddy and he a Papist.

I studied it in school, I studied it in college. I live with it every day, though I am happy to say I am not on the front line.

What I would have to say though is that the overwhleming majority of today's generation just ant to see a peace whereby no one is hurt anymore. It is the dinosaurs of British Imperialism and Irish Republicanism that continue to fight.

[dicki]

i think one of the problems now is the splinter groups have too much money and power at the moment, they are the ones involved in the drug running and prostitutiion and they are the ones making money from it... it's moved on from the religious conflict it once was to being a simple gang war with religion as a cover story

dicki

(sorry to any religious people who disagree with the above but religion often isn't worth dying for... how are you going to sing your praise to god if your dead... money is what people are dying for now)

[data]

its about time the british government practised what it is preaching - there will be no safe havens for terrorism - ok for them to go far flung but they aint so keen on sorting it out on their own doorstep - dual standards as always:(

[dicki]

well the problem is (as i've said before about the taliban) is you can't fight terrorists with conventional weapons... they just splinter disapeer and then regroup to strike again later... killing the leader will do nothing... killing most of the terrorists will do nothing... they will just appear again later

dicki

[crono]

Unless you have nowhere to live land is not worth blood. The one thing that bothers me is when the US has a stray bomb that kills a afgan family the arab world says were targeting civilans when they plot aganist us they always target civilans. The US could **** this planet up if we adopted those techniques. Ive said it always Israel and the palestine has more of a chance to bring us all to global war than any crisis in the world today. I think the Uk should just leave Ireland the UK are very strong and losing Ireland isnt like pulling out of a oil field live and let live. The world was different a 100yrs ago when everybody was wanting land we(the US) ran right over the indians which we are still trying to compensate. Just tell me what does England gain by maintaing control in Ireland, money wise ? Its just land you dont live in unless your paying tax. Last word if the IRA continues to target cilivans they are terroists and England should just get it over with and take over ireland or Get out no in between. In conclusion the British have a strong economy and good war techonoly and a very strong friend in the US let the Ireland go you dont need the the headache of a mad bomber in a subway.

[jema]

Originally posted by crono
I think the Uk should just leave Ireland the UK are very strong and losing Ireland isnt like pulling out of a oil field live and let live. The world was different a 100yrs ago when everybody was wanting land we(the US) ran right over the indians which we are still trying to compensate. Just tell me what does England gain by maintaing control in Ireland, money wise ? Its just land you dont live in unless your paying tax. Last word if the IRA continues to target cilivans they are terroists and England should just get it over with and take over ireland or Get out no in between. In conclusion the British have a strong economy and good war techonoly and a very strong friend in the US let the Ireland go you dont need the the headache of a mad bomber in a subway.

Oh boy! where do you start?

Ireland is a classic sectarian divide where neither side is going to be happy with being a minority either of catholics in Northern Ireland or as protestants in a Papist state, and given the history of hatred across the divide you can see the fears that drive the terror groups, though these groups also have an awful lot more do do with gangland control than anything else :(

The attitude that you can just waltz in and take over a Country is frankly the attitude that will result an an explosion in anti US terrorism, not immediately, but a few years down the line. Big states throwing their weight around, gives terrorist groups the influx of members and the self justification for their actions.

The Northern Ireland peace process is on an extermely rocky road, but no one can seriously say that the level of violence has not been massively reduced by people seeking a political solution. In the long term this is the only way to solve things. The ghungho attitude only ever yields short term results at an enormous future expense.

jema

[crono]

Hey jema I know so little about what is really happening over there that your reply lost me. I have always thought it was not worth the UK maintaing control over there for nothing more than gaining the land a 100yrs ago. I think Ireland should be its own state for good or worst let the people govern themselves. Reading your reply several times has sunken in Yes we could take over any country we want we choose not to because we dont need the headache Japan could be a us state, Germany could be a state, and yes England could be a us state we dont want land or dominence if we did, we could take on anybody and IF the us hadnt revolted aganist england either you would own the us or we would'nt have been there to help you in WW2. Now we are best friends and the whole world hates us you on your tiny island and us that have no enemys on our borders. Everybody hates the US and they take it out on us. Anyway joke time "why is Italy shaped like a boot ? They coulnt fit that much **** in a shoe.

[jema]

Personally I'm all for a united Ireland, ironically I think a lot of the British state, would be very happy to see the back of Northern Ireland and it's bellicose bigots (we get a carefully censored version of NI in our news, but if you are ever in the republic, they tend to broadcast the likes of Rev Ian Paisely and his anti-papist spewings!).

Trouble is that you cannot erase history and you cannot pretend the protestant community does not exist!

jema

[crono]

Bam I didnt even understand half the **** u said except u must be or live in Ireland?

[jema]

No, I'm British born and bred, though not at all religious, but I do have Irish friends, i'd like to say on both sides of the sectarian divide, but to be honest their all republicans :D

jema

[Gibbon]

I 'spose I'm a replubican in that I find the concept of the monarchy immoral, but I sure don't agree with the IRA, or any of the other terrorist organizations in Ireland... (I'm English btw)

....seems that its nothing to do with that anymore, anyways, its just a cycle of violence fuelled by the leaders quest for money & power :(

It absolutely numbs me, how these acts can be carried out at all let alone for them to be 'justified' by whichever side has commited them, as acceptable for the 'cause'

Humanity is a very worrying place sometimes....

Gibbon

[dicki]

i thought the problem in ireland (and in places like the falklands) was that one place has a legitimate claim on a country, but the people living there want to be part of england... or have i got that all wrong?

[jema]

Originally posted by Gibbon
I 'spose I'm a replubican in that I find the concept of the monarchy immoral, but I sure don't agree with the IRA, or any of the other terrorist organizations in Ireland... (I'm English btw)

....seems that its nothing to do with that anymore, anyways, its just a cycle of violence fuelled by the leaders quest for money & power :(

It absolutely numbs me, how these acts can be carried out at all let alone for them to be 'justified' by whichever side has commited them, as acceptable for the 'cause'

Humanity is a very worrying place sometimes....

Gibbon

Republican in the Irish context really just means support for the republic of Ireland being united with the north. It does not imply support for any of the self appointed terrorist republican groups.


jema

[Gibbon]

Yeah your right Jema, that might make an interesting poll actually: Who is favour of the monarchy?

Gibbon